It’s not true, you’re CIA, and even if it was true it would be a good thing.
You’re CIA.
(/s obviously)
(You’re CIA)
He’s CIA, I backtracked his IP address.
Consequences will never be the same
Lmao at CCP apologists here. Just cut the noise of “he said, she said”-type of denunciation of sources because it’s “Western” and use Occam’s razor on this. Most people don’t want to be bothered and to just get on with their lives. If the Uyghurs are indeed not being genocided, hundreds if not thousands of them would not bother to protest. Because if they aren’t, they would prefer to simply get on with their own lives. There are too many complaints not to ignore if there is no genocide happening. If there’s smoke, there’s fire.
There’s millions of complains about the covid vaccine causing seizures to autism to magnetism, it doesn’t mean covid vaccines are dangerous, it means you have to examine the selection method.
I’ve been to Urumqi, my takeaway was that I didnt have enough knowledge to understand their situation, and random people who haven’t been within 1000 miles of this place understand even less.
There’s [millions of complains about the covid vaccine causing seizures to autism to magnetism]
Isn’t this a vain and pathetic attempt to throw a red herring, comparing genocide to fake vaccine side effects like magnetism. Where are the millions of complaints you mentioned about vaccines from the website you linked, which is notoriously being doctored (pun intended) by the unqualified, antivaxxer NHS head Robert Kennedy?
Most people don’t complain if they are not being inconvenienced. That’s the point of complaining. Even Tibetans are not complaining about genocide despite the politics, because they’re not being subjected to the same treatment that Uyghurs are being subjected to.
Of course you won’t see much about Urumqi, because you haven’t been to any of the “reeducation camps”. And people who are not in camps would not dare speak about their true feelings.
people who are not in camps would not dare speak about their true feelings.
Bro it’s not 1984, people might not talk about politics online, but they absolutely will describe whatever bullshit they’re dealing with in person.
Wouldn’t it be the other way around? With the right tools online to stay anonymous, they could talk about what they feel. If asked in person, they would not open be so open because they could be talking to a secret police and be sent to one of the camps.
Getting sent to a secret camp because your neighbor is an undercover cop secretly monitoring you for wrongthink is wildly outside of anybody on earth’s experience, except North Korea, allegedly.
Sending a message on wechat and having it not arrive or having your internet cut off for 10 seconds during a live chat because your toddler walked into frame is.
There was one chinese traveler on vacation I met in Hanoi who said some out-of-pocket shit about Hitler saving Germany. I mentioned it to some other chinese folks and they were as baffled as I was, but didn’t think it was productive to confront him. I got the sense that randos with insane views are common enough they don’t have the energy to try to correct them.
undercover cop secretly monitoring you for wrongthink is wildly outside of anybody on earth’s experience, except North Korea, allegedly.
Except Russia, China, Iran, Cuba, and increasingly the US and El Salvador, allegedly.
There was one chinese traveler on vacation I met in Hanoi who said some out-of-pocket shit about Hitler saving Germany. I mentioned it to some other chinese folks and they were as baffled as I was, but didn’t think it was productive to confront him.
Anyone can say anything about Hitler because the Nazi party don’t exist anymore and was enemy of everyone except the fascists. Have you and others tried to criticise the CCP, though?
Nice try with another attempt at another red herring. That’s cute. Got any more strange attempt to derail the argument?
China, Iran, Cuba
I could believe Russia, but the people who’ve been to Cuba I’ve met show its absolutely false. The Iranians and people who’ve traveled to Iran I’ve met suggest there are religious police that do suck, but it technically being punishable doesn’t stop them from criticizing those cops to foreigners.
Have you and others tried to criticise the CCP, though
Yes, like all the time, you just have to ask about a specific policy someone has feelings on.
red herring
I’m trying to give a more general description of criticism and dissent within China.
A year or so ago, the new UK government sent a delegation to China to improve relations and shore up trade and investment deals, ignoring criticism from the left about Uyghur genocide
This is what the Tankies get fundamentally wrong about the modern world - the idea that anything anti-China is a smear to further Western Imperialism is a throwback to the cold war dichotomy of The West vs Communism.
In reality now, it’s all about investment and global trade, neoliberal wealth generation over human rights. Of course propaganda is real and everywhere, but the framing of it all as West vs East is just incredibly outdated and oversimplified.
Downplaying or waving away mistreatment of the Uyghurs puts you on the same side as Western Governments, so dismissing the issue as Western Propaganda is fundamentally flawed
Fucking thank you. I see people railing against imperialism by describing the world through an entirely imperialistic mindset. They are so lost in the sauce they can’t see straight.
Yeah, people heard their grandpa say racist/straight propaganda against a country they know in the modern day as useful and decide to go overboard protecting it as if every negative statement cant be trusted.
Its definitely not the same world anymore and protecting bad behavior of human treatment behind past victimhood does nothing to help. It just excuses away one more abuser who is trying to make a buck.
This is a country that had a one child policy for the ethnic in group. But to do this in secret betrays intention.
It’s only genocide if its from the Völkermord region in Germany. Otherwise it’s just sparkling mass murder.
The sheer volume of actual Germans on Lemmy that believe this statement and will argue about it is shocking.
Some weird guilt complex that still lingers on even though that generation will soon wither and die.
I don’t think the denazifiers realized they could denazify Germany so hard it would wrap around and back genocide as long as the perpetrators were Jewish.
The meme checks out: https://www.ceicdata.com/en/china/population-birth-rate-by-region/cn-population-birth-rate-xinjiang . Birth rate was 1.588 in 2017 and at a similar level in the years before that, 1.069 in 2018, 0.814 in 2019 and so on.
Extra surveillance and repression reportedly started in 2014, mass incarceration in 2017.
Idk, if you educate women the fertility rate usually drops, so it stands to reason if you reeducate them it’d drop even further…
So they just built a lof of universities and accepted women free of charge. So generous! We should follow their example.
Stop being racist against the Chinese you AmeriKKKan fascistic nazi! Go and read theory! /s
Pretty sure if I criticized the CCP, the wumaos will call me a “汉奸” (“han traitor”) despite me not having PRC Citizenship anymore (and I didn’t even renounce it, they were the ones that revoked it 🤷♂️)
It’s a pretty widely accepted fact that no matter your citizenship, the party will always consider you Chinese ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Out of curiosity, do you know where the phenomenon of Chinese people, outside china, referring to locals as ”外国人“ stems from？I’ve found this fascinating as in english you refer to yourself as a foreigner when you are in another country, not the locals.
Is this just a language thing, or is this also influenced by the mindset brought on by heavier nationalism (than I’m used to, anyway, in Australia), in your opinion?
Is there truly nowhere else in the world where a severe drop in birthrates is happening? Is it truly only happening in China?
If “we” is the UN (I dont consider myself part of them), which doesn’t even report on Palestine’s birth rates since the 90s because it doesnt recognize it as a state. Do you have any non-UN based sources? They are obviously western biased.
Like, there’s a lot of stuff happening why is this only a worry in China? America is experiencing a huge birth rate decline as well.
If “we” is the UN (I dont consider myself part of them), which doesn’t even report on Palestine’s birth rates since the 90s because it doesnt recognize it as a state. Do you have any non-UN based sources? They are obviously western biased.
Like, there’s a lot of stuff happening why is this only a worry in China? America is experiencing a huge birth rate decline as well.
Jesus fucking Christ.
The AP got their numbers from the UN. I’ll take an Al Jazeera article, an Indian news article, literally anything orher than western media. Just to see that it’s not a fed headline by western governments.
From 16.70 in 1990 to 11.00 in 2020 in the US. But cute attempt at misrepresentation with the graph.
Please show me a better and more accurate graph than the one i provided, or is the one i provided valid and accurate?
All i presented it as was a graph of the US birth rate. Where is my misrepresentation? I said “here is a graph”. I would love to see your grapgh of the US birthrate that you believe is a better representation.
My entire point is that a lot of places in this world right now is facing massive reductions in birth rates. This feels cherry picked to keep eyes away from western states’ same exact problems. Maybe capitalism is causing it? But the capitalist states cant have that kind of reflection. No, its the
barbariansChinese! Which is why I asked for a non-western source. Show me a source from a latin american or south american organization. An asian one. Literally anything non western please.Fuck off, fascist.
Buddy all graphs without y labelling is useless.
You could have looked this up yourself, now you look dumb and lazy and any point you were trying to make looks the same.
