The damage goes beyond the economic, it shattered the UK’s soft power. Without that soft power the UK was left at a disadvantage at every negotiating table.
Further, one could argue that the fracturing of UK/EU relations paved the way to today’s war in Europe, as almost all attention was pulled onto Brexit and none was given towards declawing Russia.
If there were any real justice in the UK, Farage and the brexiteers would all be up in front of a judge on a charge of treason. That they lied before is forgivable (they may well have believed their lies), but that many continue to do so now given the breadth and depth of evidence is beyond remotion.
IOW: Brexiteer = MUGA = Make UK Great Again
Right.
So HOW IN FUCK’S NAME is it that Nigel Farage and his party are leading the polls? You know, the very same Nigel Farage who was pushing the lie and admitted on television the very morning after the referendum that it was a lie?! Help me make sense of this, dear UK!
Truth is we’re all screeching baboons. We just covered our asses with garment. We’re generous and caring in small groups but incredible stupid and distrustful in large numbers.
“Democracy is by the people, for the people.but the people are retarded”
given his party are trying to:
- piss off pensioners by flip-flopping on the triple lock
- piss off almost all minorities by saying they’re not really british, even with settled status
- piss off white van man by having 50% of kids go to trade school to shortly take all their business
- piss off former tories by ripping up the ECHR
- piss off almost everyone disabled, gay or diverse in any other way by ripping up the equality act
I expect reform support to skyrocket.
Because don’t you know that boat people are the cause of all our problems, and we’ll be able to save the NHS only if we lower taxes, and if only we got right of the Human Rights Act, we’d be able to save the sainted homeless veterans.
It was never about economic stats, right? If the British public poured over graphs and forecasts, they would not have voted for Brexit.
In other words, if you sent this report back in time, I’m not sure it would make a difference. It’s all about personal anxieties and feels.
I’m not really disagreeing but there was also a big lie in the campaign putting out “we send the EU £50million a week. Let’s fund our NHS instead” some people definitely bought into the nonsense.
*350
Boris’ Bus of Lies with the caption is even in the thumbnail
Amazing that none of them looked into this and realised we actually got more back.
At the time I worked with a man from north Wales, who voted Brexit cause south Wales got the bulk of the money assigned to Wales. Make that make sense.
None of them looked into it because facts don’t matter to far-right populists and the sheep voting for them. They just make up shit that fits their simple narrative of the moment and makes people angry. And when (not if) it is debunked as a blatant lie later on, they have already captured their audience with ten new lies, so the implosion of all the older lies won’t register with them.
I get that perverted ‘logic’. What confounds me is that so many people seem to be falling for this shit. I had a more optimistic idea of people’s intelligence on average. And: I don’t like what this finding means for future-proofing our democracies, if we’re going to save those.
Literally can ot interact with this site. Get a pop up about push notifications, No button doesn’t respond. Then another pop up. Site’s broken. And I’m really sick of wrestling with an entire Internet that’s the same.
Firefox + uBlock Origin on Android here. The site works alright.
maybe next time dont listen to russian propaganda.
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Maybe russia should stop being the bad guy. Easy as that
The ties were pretty clear with the Brexit propaganda campaign.
As are the ties with other far right movements around the world.
Look here is one of their shills now.
That’s one way to put it.
Try this: “Russia is bad for this world”
Are you suggesting Russia should be destroyed?
I suggest russia china india and america and canada should be decolonised and balcanised
Specifically Russian leadership. Without a doubt. Try this: “Putin is bad for Russia”
Man, sometimes I hate internet discourse, everything is hyperbole all the time and the only recognized positions are extremes.
“maybe next time dont listen to russian propaganda.” - “You think […] Brexit only exists because of Russia?”
“Russia is bad for this world” - “Are you suggesting Russia should be destroyed?”It’s so draining.
totally agree. they’re bad faith actors. said my piece, but not for his benefit. now i block him.
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And again jumping on shit nobody here said or even insinuated.
Someone just mentions that Brits should not have listened to Russian propaganda concerning Brexit and you immediately start this entire script fighting one strawman after another, somehow ending up in american politics for fucks sake.
Nobody said it was only due to propaganda, nobody even said it was mainly due to propaganda, nobody said that Russia should be destroyed.
Calm down mate, take a breather and stop fighting things you just imagine that other people are saying, because they’re not.
This ‘I’m so tired of internet discourse’ act is a classic move to shut down a conversation you’re losing. You’re conflating a critique of a toxic leadership with a call for destruction because you can’t actually defend Putin’s record. Russia’s military is an international embarrassment and its leadership is a global parasite; those aren’t ‘extreme positions,’ they’re the consensus of anyone not on the Kremlin’s payroll. You aren’t ‘drained’—you’re just out of arguments.Dude, I’m not the person you were responding to and I’m on your side in this?
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Well I never mentioned destroying anyone so I didn’t think I needed to specify what needed to be destroyed until that was brought up.
Try this: “Russia is bad for this world”
is what I was responding to
Lol what? You think that because Russia spread some money around Brexit only exists because of Russia?
It’s like the idiots in the US that ignore 70 million people voted for Trump, and want to pretend the only reason for that is that Russia spent $100,000 on Facebook ads. Because they don’t want to address the actual problems that’s destroying their societies. Much easier to just claim it’s all Putler or something.
The United Kingdom, merely described as an “extraterritorial floating base of the U.S.”, should be cut off from the European Union.
– Foundations of Geopolitics (1997) by Aleksandr Dugin
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics
Also see:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_Brexit_referendum
Do you not understand that just because something is to Russia’s advantage, and Russia wants it to happen, does not mean that Russia can make it happen?
If you think Brexit was to the benefit of Russia, and you oppose Russia’s government (as you should) - OK. Then why wouldn’t you want to address the root causes that are powering anti-EU parties all over? Take away the fuel.
Why did Russia bother doing anything if it would’ve happened regardless apparently?
To aid it and make it worse?
The West pretty much showed to Russia in the 1990s and 2000s that it was going to consider international relations a zero sum game. So Russia is of course going to work to make the problems the US and UK have worse, as the US has done with Russia.
But once you worsen a problem enough, you are the primary cause.
Conspiracy nuts are harmless until their opinions become more widespread. The root cause is social media illiteracy but if you have nation states acting as fire accelerants every single sparking wire can result in an inferno.
Oh, and this didn’t even start in the 90s. The Soviets didn’t spread HIV conspiracy theories for fun and games.
Who could have thought that separating yourself from one of the top 3 economies in the world would have negative consequences?
For a decade, Brexit’s defenders have insisted the warnings were exaggerated and the pain temporary. The latest evidence shows the opposite. Brexit hasn’t been a one-off hit followed by recovery – it has quietly, relentlessly drained the UK economy year after year.
The headline numbers are brutal. UK GDP is now 6–8 per cent smaller than it would have been by 2025 – worse than forecast, not better. That is a permanent loss of national income, not a blip.
Investment has collapsed. UK business investment is 18 per cent lower than in comparable economies, as firms put money on hold or moved it elsewhere. Employment and productivity are both around 4 per cent lower, locking in weaker wage growth and lower living standards.
And as a consequence, people will elect Reform at the next general election.
Yup. Cause if policy born of nationalism and bigotry couldn’t solve our problems the first time around, surely we just weren’t using enough of it. /s
It’s easier to blame immigrants and people on benefits for the problems in the economy, than realise the real problem is the leaches at the top sucking away every spare penny the working class makes.
The landlords, the executives, the millionaires, the billionaires - where do people think their money comes from?
Everything costs more, but not because it actually costs more to make - but because the profits must always go up to fuel the hoards of the wealthy.
Why are landlords so hated? Renting isn’t always a bad option.
Because they symbolize the privatization of a basic human right. Because rent is a “poor peoples tax” - and most people are poor, all things considered. You get the gist. Also: For most people, renting isn’t an option - it’s the only option.
Yeah, if its the only option then it’s bad, but the convenience isn’t too be underestimated. I rented when I was in Uni, didn’t even consider buying at that point. Didn’t want to commit that much money to a city i didn’t know if I wanted to live in.
it’s not renting that’s being criticized here; it’s specifically landlords.
renting is perfectly fine.
what is not fine, is that a public necessity is tied to a private individual or company that can charge whatever they want.
that last part is the problem.
vienna often gets cited as a notable example for large scale, affordable public housing projects, and while that is fair, the reason those are affordable, is because they are owned by the public, i.e. the city of vienna.
THAT’S how rent is supposed to work: for the people, by the people.
it’s how a society gets affordable housing, not this price gouging nonsense that neoliberal politics has popularized…
But then the problem isn’t landlords, it’s policy.
Put the blame where it should be, the people voting for stupid policy.
Couldn’t agree more. Paying some amount of money for upkeep and so forth makes sense, be it for your own home or for one you don’t own. Paying rent just to make someone else rich(er) should not be a thing in the first place in my opinion, because then the basic function changes from providing shelter to generating as much profit as possible. In every major city this problem is quite apparent: Exploding rents, vacant apartment complexes that only exist as speculation objects, owners not spending anything on maintenance because short term profits are more important than long term sustainability. Man, I could go on, but my mood tanked enough as it is haha
This leaves Britain as a rare modern case study: a rich country that deliberately raised barriers to trade and cooperation and paid the price.
I’m not convinced yet. Please, would another country with an even bigger GDP deliberately raise barriers to trade and cooperation?
Hold my bear…
-TrumpI wish he had a bear. It might maul him.
Trump can’t spell, I totally didn’t make a typo!
A man who stands by his typos is worthy of my friendship.
Yeah, but a bunch of extremely rich people made a lot of money.
And everyone with half a brain cell has been warning of exactly this since when this Brexit madness started.
why doesn’t anyone get on TV and tell the ppl this? why is there no concerted pushback against the propaganda?
The people you want to tell say “Brexit wasn’t done properly”.
The same people, probably, that say Corbyn would have ruined the economy, and when pushed say “well it’s obvious isn’t it”.
Is the propaganda about this still there? Or just not a topic anymore in general?
it’s still around, tho not as heightened since the damage is done.
the ppl need to be de-programmed tho, so showcasing to everyone how it failed, who it benefits, would be wise imo.
why is there no concerted pushback against the propaganda?
Excellent, keep going. Almost there!
this just isn’t a helpful comment.
even if you’re implying conspiracy, surely not EVERYONE would be on board, yet still, nothing.
The people who own the TV content are pushing the propaganda. That’s why.
I don’t doubt that, but at the same time it’s hard for me to accept that every avenue to reach the populace has been so completely co-opted in the UK.
There’s the social media angle, which theoretically would be individuals creating content not owned by billionaires.
That’s where Cambridge Analytica comes in to close the gap. If there’s another avenue (besides local face-to-face meetings) we’d love to hear it.
Why aren’t the pro-brexit people being shamed? Stripped of their wealth and made to spend the rest of their miserable lives doing community service?
The people too lazy to vote for remain also deserve some of the blame
uh, because it was a referendum of the people and 17 million xenophobic idiots voted for it.
I’m beginning to think there is a problem with democracy.
It’s even darker than that - a lot of the leave votes were elderly folks who voted how their newspapers told them to (daily fail was a big “LEAVE” proponent).
Those people are, mostly, dead or trapped in the later stages of dementia now.
17 million voters of 60 something million voted for it. The other quarter or so of the population that voted, voted Remain. And on the basis of that quarter of the population that voted, we left. It’s ridiculous, embarrassing, stupid as shooting yourself in the foot.
If enough people do something wrong, it becomes right.
That sounds like some justification right out of the Nuremberg trial.
I am shocked about how accurate my prediction was back before the election, I predicted that UK would lose about 1% per year over many years, if they voted Brexit.
And here we are now 10 years after the vote, and 8 years after Brexit was effectuated, and the relative decline to non Brexit is estimated at 6-8%.If UK doesn’t manage a free trade agreement with EU, I suspect this will continue for another decade, possibly at a slightly lower rate.
If UK does manage to get a good deal with EU, things will return to almost normal, but the investments that were lost this past decade will remain lost. So UK will continue from the lower level they are at now.
If UK does manage to get a good deal with EU, things will return to almost normal, but the investments that were lost this past decade will remain lost. So UK will continue from the lower level they are at now.
Don’t worry, they won’t. And if they do, it won’t ever be as beneficial as their original EU membership was. Even a new EU membership won’t come with all the exemptions and special privileges the old one had. Many things that were optional (or didn’t yet exist) back when the UK originally joined the EU are now mandatory for new members. This is utterly unpalatable to UK politicians with their weird obsession about being the mighty empire of global Britain.
it won’t ever be as beneficial as their original EU membership was.
I absolutely agree, that ship has sailed in more ways than one. First UK does not have the advantages they did in the early 70’s. Second their disruptive behavior in EU and Brexit reduce the political goodwill from European countries that also existed in the 70’s.
So absolutely there is no chance in hell they will get a “half price” membership again.
Still they might be able to negotiate a deal more like Norway and Switzerland.Still they might be able to negotiate a deal more like Norway and Switzerland.
Not really, because that would mean accepting regulatory alignment and freedom of movement, and paying their share.
Which the people of UK seem to soften up to, especially now because conditions internationally have gotten a lot worse than when UK voted for Brexit.
There is no way UK can trust USA as a partner now, as they may have hoped for.
Keir Starmer has also expressed opinions that are very close to what Mark Carney said in his brilliant speech at Davos.
Most of UK has realized the times are no longer suitable for standing alone as a so called middle power. Closer cooperation is necessary, and EU is their natural closest partner, both geographically and politically.There is little doubt we will se closer cooperation in the near future between UK and EU on both defense and economy.
Edit: Typo
It is also a flashing red warning to any country flirting with economic nationalism, trade wars or the fantasy that sovereignty can replace integration.
I don’t think any other country would be so stu-… Oh, wait a second.
I don’t know about the other four, but John Cleese famously spent his entire career dodging taxes and then – no surprise – was pro-Brexit. Also no surprise: he was listed in Epstein’s black book.
I mean… come after him for his tax dodging, his extremely bad political takes, his Brexit munching… but just being listed in Epstein’s black book with two phone numbers is basically nothing. The Maxwellsteins were socialites and knew people, lots of people, even innocent people. There is nothing placing Cleese at any of their properties or parties. So throwing that at him will only lessen the power of Epstein-accusations against those who really deserve it.
Fuck that motherfucker… but do it for the motherfucking he did, not the kiddy-fucking he (likely) didn’t.
